PTW

I see that we are having problems with the Guy living near the Start of this Ten(R10/23) once again .
Perhaps it might be a good idea to start it somewhere away from this little hamlet of houses,say further down the road?
I am Timekeeping the next event(R10/23) and don't fancy yet more confrontation.
Any suggestions?

A MACHINE GUN.

I agree Peter. We had a reasonable time of it last season but last week wasn't a pleasant experience and slightly dangerous in having an elderly lady standing in the middle of the road shouting the odds with riders having to go close to the centreline to pass her. And that was BEFORE the main event...

Even if the course becomes a slightly non-standard distance a little change is required. Are you able to do a recce Pete? Perhaps with some distances and possible positions for the finishing timekeeper (car not on road).

Why is,nt she reported to the police for creating a disturbance?we have a right to use the road ,is this the same people who Dave Abbott had a run in with ,when out on a normal ride back last year?and had a go at Jeff when he was not even riding along that stretch of road!

Alfie wrote

I agree Peter. We had a reasonable time of it last season but last week wasn't a pleasant experience and slightly dangerous in having an elderly lady standing in the middle of the road shouting the odds with riders having to go close to the centreline to pass her. And that was BEFORE the main event...

Even if the course becomes a slightly non-standard distance a little change is required. Are you able to do a recce Pete? Perhaps with some distances and possible positions for the finishing timekeeper (car not on road).

I,ll do a "Recce" as you suggest Alf.If i remember Swansea Wheelers and Abercynon used to do a different version on the R10/23,will have a chat with them.

How about starting at the burger van layby ? It would mean stretching the course by 150 - 200 yards as there isn't anywhere safe to finish in the 800 yards prior to the existing finish

or

start at the bus stop 100 yards after the start and finish 100 yards further along. This would mean finishing close to the entrance of the Rheola pond.

How would it be, if it started back towards glyn neath,( there's a new car park for the colliery workers) and finishes opposite the burger van layby. Personally, I must agree with Pip,we shouldn't be bullied into changing the course, that's just the top of a very slippery slope.they'll have us all trying to race on cycle tracks before u know it or dressing in black with no numbers and that goes back to before Colin Speakman joined the club . Just phone the Police and report an old lady wandering haplessly along the road, " aaaah!, poor luv, don't know where she is and she seems a little worse for wear, sorry to trouble you, but, she's putting herself and other road users in danger".

I think a 10 mile TT should be 10 miles long. If two other safe places can be found that are exactly 10.00 miles apart, then all well and good, but I suspect such places are hard to find. We should be happy to consider moving to another start and finish, should such locations be found, but the onus is certainly not on us to go to any effort to find them.

We should make sure that no cars are taken to the start, if feasible. Not one. The time-keeper can park at the finish and ride up, unless there's a cast-iron reason not to (or indeed a titanium one, Peter). And there's no reason we have to stand on the grass either - just stand on the road. We will then have done everything in our power to accommodate them. Whatever else they might try to complain about will only weaken their position.

Pete - just in case he couldn't get hold of you John Williams has some thoughts on a minor course revision.

Hi Guys Interesting debate,

I almost agree with Bill, in that a ten mile course has to measure ten miles and also the start and finish area must be no further than 1.5 miles apart, if not it will not a recognised course and therefore any times recorded will be null and void to the individual. There are however more important issues to be considered.

CTT rules require that
Course Measurement

(a) Each District Committee shall prepare a schedule of its approved courses. Standard distance courses shall be measured and checked by appointed course measurers.

Each course measurer shall submit a written report specifying intermediate points and their distances. These shall include the start, finish and all turning points specifically defined, supported by revolution counter readings of a cycle wheel. The distance shall be certified by him to be not less than that specified.

(b) Measurements shall be calculated from the recorded revolutions of a cycle wheel, the constant of which shall be determined by riding over an accurately measured standard distance of not less than half a mile, immediately prior to and after measuring the course or any part of it.

(c) Each course shall be measured from start to finish in the direction in which it is to be ridden, and along a line that a competitor would normally follow. The finishing point shall be so fixed that a rider completing the course cannot have covered less than the specified distance.

In short if we wish to change the course this must be done by an appointed course measurer not as an ad hoc internal process.

For info, even our club events are run on behalf of the CTT and not just as on behalf of the club, we pay the CTT a levy for every person that rides and we must comply with the rules of the CTT. Under this system we as individuals and the club as the organisational body are covered by the CTT insurance provided we comply with the rules and regulations.

The current course start and end points are agreed by the CTT, if we moved them without CTT approval and an accident occured at these revised locations, where would we stand legally, would we be covered by CTT insurance if using a non recognised course?

Last time we rode the course as a there was no problem unfortunately, on this occasion, Garry (unwittingly) parked in the access gate to the gentlemans plant Hire business, and Alf (also unwittingly) parked his car on the grass that the gentleman does cut opposite his house and is in full view of his living room. Arguably, if we parked on the grass up the road from the start, then there would have been less of an issue as it would not be so visible and also it would offer some protection to the starting riders from oncoming traffic. so I do not quite agree with bill that no car should be taken to the start.

I also cannot agree with prescribing that anyone stands on the road, as clearly this clearly increases the risk of accidents by haveing someone stand in the road and would probably push riders further into the carriageway.

In conclusion, I am not saying we should not change the course, but this would need to be done by an appointed course measurer and not by any individual club member.

The other option I guess is that the CTT withdraw the use of the course.. Unfortunately I will be on hlidays on June 2nd otherwise I would time the event I am availabale on June 7th and Sept 1st so I will time those unless we can get Norman James to find an alternative..

Hope that makes sense.

Les are your fingers still attatched after that book (wot you just wrote}. Completely agree. As my old mate church said "WE,LL FIGHT THEM ON THE BEACHES".

Aye fingers all present and correct.......... I've always thought........... it a shame that I type faster than I can ride a bike.....